023 | Permission to Quit the Thing That’s Just Not Working Out with Duo Collective Artwork

Raising Kids & Running a Business

On Raising Kids & Running a Business host Kate Christy (designer + mom x3) talks with other mothers all about what it’s like to manage the mental load of motherhood while building a career and quite frankly how they’re keeping both the creativity and the kids alive. We have honest conversations about what we’re doing (or not doing) to chase our dreams, the lessons we’ve learned, sacrifices made, and permission slips we’re writing to pursue our version of success.And real talk. Moms get sh*t done. Which is why we’re also talking tools and mindset shifts we use to flip the script from overwhelmed and overworked to creating our own version of work/life balance. Whether you’re an entrepreneur running your own business or kicking it in corporate from 9-5. Inside these episodes you’ll find the whole truth—not just the highlight reel—about what it’s really like amidst the chaos of raising kids and building a career.

All Episodes

Raising Kids & Running a Business

023 | Permission to Quit the Thing That’s Just Not Working Out with Duo Collective

July 03, 2024 • Kate Christy • Season 1 • Episode 23

In this episode, Abbey and Courtney of Duo Collective talk about their intertwined journeys in motherhood and entrepreneurship. They delve into the challenges of starting a business while caring for young children, transitioning to full-time roles, and balancing personal struggles such as fertility issues and miscarriages.

Both Abbey and Courtney candidly and courageously discuss their missteps, such as investing in business endeavors that just didn’t work out like they envisioned, and the critical lessons learned from those experiences.

This conversation highlights the importance of honesty with clients, community support, and focusing on what makes both your professional and personal life feel good.

Abbey and Courtney offer practical advice for working mothers, advocating for defining personal and professional goals without external pressures.

They also discuss the value of open communication with business partners and spouses, and how to navigate feelings of guilt when making difficult decisions.

Their story reminds us why we should stay true to what we love in business to find that balance that works for us. Consider this a must-listen if you’re seeking harmony between your professional and family lives.

Highlights

Balancing Act: managing the demands of motherhood and running a business, highlighting the need for honesty and open communication.
The Courage to Pivot: making the difficult decision to shut down a new business initiative that wasn't aligning with their passion or serving their clients effectively.
Community and Support: the importance of having a supportive community, both personally and professionally, and how it helps navigate challenging times.
Defining Success on Your Terms: advice on taking time to define what success looks like for you without the noise of outside expectations.
Navigating Guilt: Addressing the common feelings of guilt when quitting something that doesn't work and understanding it's a part of the entrepreneurial journey.
Practical Advice for Working Mothers: tips on managing both business and motherhood, including setting clear goals and finding a supportive network.
Authenticity in Business: emphasizing the importance of staying true to what you love and are passionate about in business.
Humor and Real Talk: a candid conversation filled with humor and real-life anecdotes about the intersection of professional and family life.

Connect with Duo Collective online:

Connect with Kate Christy:

Kate Christy: I'm your host, Kate Christie, and today I'm sitting down with the duo from Duo Collective, Courtney and Abby. Hello, ladies. How are we doing today?

Abbey: Hello, we are great. We practice that. Yeah, we did. We synchronize everything. Perfect

Kate Christy: unison. I'm so excited to chat with a duo because you all are running your business together, but you're also going through motherhood together.

So I'd really love for you all to share with us. Who you are, your backstory a little bit and kind of how you all formed your business together. And then what that, you know, motherhood journey has looked like when it came into play with business, what came first, what came second, if it came in the middle, just like kind of give us the backstory.

Abbey: Oh, goodness. So this is Abby. I'll start. my motherhood journey started a little bit earlier. So, basically for us, we started duo when I had a four month old. I feel like the second you become a mom, a lot of people tell you like, Your priorities change, the things that you want or that you envision in your future just changes.

or the second you even make that decision of like, I want to be a mom, like your things just change. for me, it definitely changed in the realm of I didn't want to work at an agency anymore. So our backstory is Court and I met. At a marketing agency that we worked at, we worked there together for a long time and then eventually got put on the same client and work in the same ish capacity.

Now that we did, then, court was on the design side. I was on the account team and then together with our clients. We, Kind of were that team. So Courtney and did the brandy and I did the project management and a lot of the account work and all of that. So, we would take lots and lots of coffee breaks and would just ideate all of the things that we wanted to do.

And outside of the agency, like what business could we start court wanted to make a new tick tock. Yeah,

Courtney: I was definitely in the mindset of like, okay, we have to make this new app. Like we have to make this thing. It's going to make us billionaires and then we don't have to work ever again. And that was a little extreme.

So Abby, she had the aha moment where she was just like, how about we just do what we do now, but for small businesses? And I was like, Oh, Yeah. Yeah. We can do that. Definitely. Yeah. So that's kind of how a duo was born. Essentially just roaming the skyway, downtown Minneapolis, grabbing coffee and just realizing that we have talents to do the things that small businesses and entrepreneurs are looking for.

So why not serve them with a little bit more? Our own business. However, we want to structure it versus, filling the pockets of large corporations. So,

Abbey: yeah, we've evolved so much even since those days too, which I know every entrepreneur has as well. Like you just pivot and make changes and you just go with the flow as much as you can.

it was just kind of crazy, coming back from maternity leave. Court and I would just have these conversations and we would work in every spare moment outside of our agency day. So court would come over at night. We would be working on my back patio, ordering tacos doing bedtime with my baby and like all the things.

so we did all of that and did both for a while. And then I actually came full time after my second. So, my kids are 18 months apart, so they're very close. And, When I finished my maternity leave, that is when I went full time duo. So the mix of like early days of duo is very much mixed with little babies and all of that craziness of the infant stage,

Courtney: I'll never forget.

We were walking the Skyway one day and we had already kind of started duo and Abby. She looked at me and she was like, okay, I have something to tell you. And I just had this feeling. I was like, oh my gosh, she's pregnant. And I was ready to celebrate with her and be super excited. And she's like, I'm pregnant.

And I was like, Oh my gosh, that's so excited. And she was, and they knew they wanted a second, but they didn't know that they were gonna get a second that quickly.

she's like, Oh my gosh, Courtney, but we're starting this thing and I'm like, we'll figure it out. It's fine. Like, that's so exciting. And she's like, But Courtney, I'm pregnant and I'm like, yeah, it's going to be

Abbey: okay.

It's like, I have a baby and I'm going to have another baby. and also it's so funny because looking back, it was perfect timing. was perfect about it. it ended up that I was able to go full time and do all right after my second maternity leave. And. That probably would not have happened if I didn't have another baby.

And if I didn't have those decisions of like, okay, daycare. And like, also, how am I going to work and do all of this and also run another business? Like there had to be a point where I had to make that shift. So in hindsight, it was perfect timing, but when I had a nine month old and I was pregnant with another baby, I was a little bit like.

Wow. This is crazy.

Kate Christy: Yeah. I'm sure at that very beginning of having those two babies simultaneously was just wild. But now you're like, checked that off the list simultaneously. So we're out, out of that thing.

Abbey: I know. Yes. We are officially out of diapers. Potty training is not fun, but my kids now are, almost five, which is crazy.

So that means duo. I always use my oldest as duos, like kind of birthday, birthday. Yeah. So duo is almost five and then my other is three. So, that's fun. And they're

the best little friends ever.

Abbey: They are. They're the best buds.

Kate Christy: Oh, that's so cool. So, uh, Courtney, what about you in your journey to motherhood with business?

Yeah. So my journey to motherhood, it started off really rocky, unfortunately. so Abby had quit right after her second maternity leave and was running duo full time and I was still at the agency for another year, a year and a half after Abby quit and went duo full time. So she was really running a lot of duo, because I was still working at the agency full time, eight hours plus a day.

And then as soon as I was done at the agency, I'd log off and I would start doing duo stuff too. So at the beginning, I unfortunately didn't have as much time to focus on duo because of my other job. and it was fine. It was what my husband and I had to do at the time because he had just recently quit his Full time gig too, and started his own business. So that was like 2020. So it was just like COVID hit. And then he's like, I'm quitting and starting my own business. And I was like, well, what about me? I wanted to quit and do my own business too. So we had to sit down and just like figure out what that looked like.

Luckily that all worked out, but right, I put my two week notice in at the agency, about a year and a half after Abby had quit and I was pregnant at that time. And right when my two weeks was just about done, I had a miscarriage. So we lost the baby and it was such a weird time because I was so excited because I was newly pregnant.

I was so excited because I was quitting my agency job. So And I was going to dive headfirst into duo. So I was just like, all of these new things were kind of happening for me. And then we had the loss and it was very devastating. And obviously shared it with Abby right away. And she's like, okay, well, you just need to take whatever time you need to take for yourself.

And I'll talk to our clients. They'll understand. and so as weird as it is, like the timing of that, it's not something that you ever wish upon anybody or you want to go through yourself. But if I would have had that loss while at the agency, while running duo, I think that would have been a lot harder on me.

So the timing of it, again, so weird to say, but it was. Nice, because I was able to lean on Abby and she was there to support me and I didn't have to worry about going back to my agency job and either a telling them or B keeping it secretive and like trying to work through that, because I know that's a huge thing in the corporate America is that when women have losses like this, they still have to show up at work, like you can't just.

Take time off. or you're dipping into your vacation or whatever. So, for me, it was very fortunate in that aspect. And then, we were told that we could try right away. So we did and actually got pregnant the very next cycle and we lost that pregnancy as well. So I had two back to back miscarriages, within a matter of months of each other, right when I started Duo full time.

And I'll remember Abby was on her way to California for a wedding, I think. And I sent her a text that we had lost our second baby. And I'm sure for her, it was almost just as devastating because she is trying to run this business while be there for me emotionally and support me. But also like, how do we keep pushing this business forward when I've got client work that I have to work on too?

So. it was rough. It and I think because I was in such a hard mental Space at the time. I didn't think about what maybe Abby was going through at that moment too. And she always told me, she's like, don't worry about it. Don't worry about the business. Don't worry about me. Family comes first, but now that it's been a couple of years, I can only imagine like the stress and anxiety too, that she was under with trying to help me emotionally while also trying to run the business while also being a mom to her two little babies too.

So It was a very rough start, but then, my husband and I, we kind of took a break and decided we started doing like acupuncture and kind of just tapping into all these things that we could do to just help our fertility journey. And we got pregnant last August with our rainbow baby, our double rainbow baby, Mila, and she was born, this past spring.

I mean, the best thing that's ever happened to us, but that pregnancy also was very, very full of anxiety just because the only thing I knew was loss. So I was just, preparing myself for loss again, but, we made it and she's here and motherhood is amazing, but it's incredible how much.

Your world just changes. Like you are no longer an individual. You are taking care of this human. And, like Abby said, a lot of your priorities kind of shift or change, or you have to figure out, okay, duo is also my baby in a different capacity. So how do I nurture and grow? My business while I'll also nurturing and growing my daughter.

So, it's a whole new ball game. So I think it's a matter of figuring out what my schedule looks like now. And I was very terrified of daycare, but now daycare is like such a blessing because we're so busy right now that I'm like, if I didn't have daycare, I tried to do the, like work with her at home at the same time.

And I was like, Oh, this is just, it's way too hard. I need somebody to watch my baby during the day. So, but, It's been great. And I have Abby to lean on and she knows all the things about motherhood. it's been really, I don't know about all things. She knows enough.

Abbey: I'm just a couple of years ahead, but still lost, still lost.

Kate Christy: Yeah. So that sounds like a really wild start in time because you both had, I mean, Abby had already made the transition, but then you're both like, okay, we've, put all our eggs in this basket and now. Things feel like they're falling apart. was there any moment in that time that either one of you thought like, maybe this isn't the right move now for your business?

Or was it just head down, like, we're going to get through this and get to the other side of it. What did that look like just from the keeping the business going perspective?

was a little bit of both. I think some days and some weeks we were like, okay, we've got this.

We've just got to work really hard and we've got to get through, the ups and downs of our business and the ups and downs of our personal life. And then I think some weeks we were like, this is crazy. This is too much. what are we doing?

Yeah.

but I think we had to keep reminding ourselves that we were in such

weird, intense times of our lives. Like she had these two babies. I was going through these fertility issues. So I think we had to just step back and be like, okay, even if we didn't have jobs, the stuff that we're going through right now is Incredibly hard, rewarding, yes, but hard.

you have a business to run on top of it. That's a brand new business too. And you're trying to establish yourself. So I think we just had to keep reminding ourselves that we're in a really crazy point in both of our lives right now. This is probably going to be one of the hardest times of our lives slash business.

And if we can get through this and get to the other side, Then we can do anything, essentially.

Abbey: Yeah, the imposter syndrome is real when you are navigating this journey, because you'll look at all these other people who are less amount of time in business, but feel farther ahead. And you look at their life and they don't have anyone else to care for in their life at this point.

And you look at that and you're like, You try to compare yourself to that but you have totally different priorities. You're in totally different stages of life and I think shutting off social media in those times are really like understanding who you're following and whether that's speaking to you because it's not about like, Yeah, of course.

We want to grow our business, reach more people, make more money like everyone does. That's great. But also a huge part of starting our business was to be able to have that coexistence of family and be able to do something that we truly love and feel really good about and be able to mix it and be able to say, Hey, I don't want to work today.

I'm going to go to the zoo. all of that was priorities for us and our priority isn't just growing our bottom line. And I think you have to remember that because in this World right now of the entrepreneurship hustle, it doesn't quite fit into what we value and why we started our business. And we do need those constant reminders because it can be really hard to fall into like that imposter syndrome period of just looking at all of that online and feeling like you're somehow behind.

Kate Christy: Yeah, I really had to audit a lot of people that I was following in the same business space as me because I would look and be like, man, like they just launched this thing or they just added this offer. They're, doing these amazing things and I'm like, they have one person to care for just one themselves.

That's it. that's not a fair comparison. So back away from that. you can. look to that, take the positives from it, but like, if you're pulling negatives from it, just back away from that for sure. so I definitely had to audit myself in who I was consuming content from just because, you still have hopes and dreams and desires as an individual, right?

But. The reality of being a mom and having even multiple kids, right, is that there's no changing that and you don't want to change that. That's your reality. That's how life is. That's the season that you're in. And so finding those things that you can look to, to be inspired by, or to, take, yeah, just like take inspiration from without making you feel resentful of your situation.

Right. I don't want to say like, I resent my kids cause I don't, I love my kids. But at the same time, you see someone who's further along and you're like, dang it, I wish I could do that, but your reality is you can't andit's finding that, balance and that peace within yourself around.

Like, okay, what do I want for my business? What I want for myself and what's actually. Achievable in this season right now, like, let me set myself up for success, not failure and not just, rolling around and all the things that I'm unable to accomplish right now, but really focusing on what's really important and what I can accomplish right now.

That's been a hard lesson that I've been going through currently. I have three children and number three was total surprise. We were totally done and I love her. She's amazing. She's wild. But when I found out I was pregnant, I was like, Oh my gosh, just like light at the end of the tunnel is so far away now because I my youngest at the time was going to preschool in the fall.

And I found out I was pregnant in the spring and I was like, all these plans that I had and goals that I had and like just relief of having kids are in school. I can work while they're in school. And then I was like, Oh, this is gone. It's gone.

I'm like freaking out a

Kate Christy: little but it was just about resetting those expectations for myself and, being okay with being upset about the reality, but also being able to kind of reframe.

What I can accomplish and what the season is going to look like to me and what's going to make me the happiest. Right? And then you said about, I don't want to work today. I want to take the kids to the zoo, you having that flexibility. And that's something that's so exciting and wonderful about entrepreneurship.

But I think a lot of us, Make a kind of, structure for ourselves that we came out of in like a corporate space because we get into our business and we're like, okay, we've got to like, follow these rules. We've got to do this, like that hustle thing. Right? You kind of get sucked into that. And then you're like, holy smokes.

this is not flexible or free or easy. Like, I thought it was going to be, Yeah, so that was a ramble on that front, but

yeah, I remember when we first started and like I was done with the agency, we were in our own thing and I was like, Oh, I have to get something at target. And I was like, Oh. I can just like run to target right now, be there for an hour if I wanted and come back home and work.

it was so weird, the concept of just being able to be like, Oh, I'm going to run and go get a coffee or I'm going to run to target and like, I'm not at my desk or my boss isn't behind me watching me like, where is she going? What is she doing? when is she going to be back at her desk? She's got this thing done.

And I was like, wow, that freedom, like you have certain freedoms, but then again, You have so much responsibility too, because you're running this business that you also don't have certain freedoms. So it's really weird that change from like the corporate world to running your own thing. you've got to show up and you've got to be running that thing, but you also can go to the zoo on a Tuesday afternoon and tell your business partner like, Hey, I'm going to the zoo.

You know, I'm logged off for the day. I'll be back on tomorrow. I'm going to be like, cool.

Abbey: Have fun. Yeah. it's a mental load more than a time load. Mm-Hmm. . that was the biggest understanding and like when we made this shift, is like, you might not be working as long, which, and like, let's be real, we were working more, but you might not be working as long, but mentally you never.

Stop thinking about your business ever. it does not shut off and it's because it is your baby and it's something you're growing. It's not something you have to do or have to think about, but finding ways to shut it off and truly like relax and like, that's kind of the phase it's hard. Yeah. It's the phase that I'm in right now is trying to figure out, I need that.

Hard boundaries, to make sure that I am happy because I need to balance both work and let in my kids. And I love both of them so much. But when they compete with each other, it gets really hard. So that's definitely something that was the mental load of what you're doing is so so much heavier than just the amount of hours that you're working.

Yeah, and as much

as we love our business and our families, there are some days where I'm like, gosh, I wish I worked at a job where it's like, I clock in, I clock out, I go home and I don't have to think about that job anymore because I am actually physically. Clocked out, whereas in your own business, you are never clocked out.

something's always going on in the back of your brain. Or you're always like, oh, well, I can just pop an email real quick. Or, oh, I could just go do this thing real quick. I've got a half an hour. can never truly get away from your business

Abbey: there. I have a girlfriend who's also, she's been a client of ours and also has her own business.

And I've talked to her about this before because I will text her and I will say, Have you ever just daydreamed about what it's like to be a stay at home mom? just a stay at home mom, not an entrepreneur. And she's like, all the time. now, when I say that out loud, I guarantee you, some people are being like, don't you feel guilty about that?

Or like, That guilt creeps in of like, why do I feel that way? should I not be running my business? Should I not be doing this? And it's like, absolutely not. I love it. It doesn't mean that I don't aspire for a day where I'm just a mom without the mental load of a business. Like it's still heavy.

I don't feel guilty about that. It's still like a daydream's daydream. It doesn't matter. But I think so many people probably feel that way and then think what's wrong with me. because like as an entrepreneur, you should love what you do. you should be so happy. Every. moment of every day, but there's still hard times.

I can still be happy and it can be hard all at the same time. Those things can co exist. And that was something that I had to realize. It wasn't like this constant state of happiness. Like that's make believe land. It's understanding that happiness and hard can co exist together.

Kate Christy: Yeah, no, I love that.

Because when you become a mother and when you, Become a business owner to like, you can become very siloed in those identities, right? you become a mom and you just get so engrossed in it because really there's no other option, It's constant feeding, changing, it's just around the clock, right?

And you just become so in the trenches of this is my identity. This is my life. this is the only thing my brain can run on right now. And then same with business, right? If that's the only thing that, know, if you're not juggling kids. Or anything else, right? Like you can get sucked into that being, this business owner.

And I think that like you said, like, it is not black and white. Like, I can love being a mom and I can love being a business owner, but I can also have daydreams about what it would look like to not have to deal with either at the same time, or maybe deal with one and not the other. And I have a daydream that, I'm a bartender and there's just like, yeah.

No mental love on a cruise ship somewhere

Abbey: in Aruba. Yeah. I love that.

Kate Christy: Yeah. my other one is a blackjack dealer on a riverboat casino. So in another life, right. I know that's

Abbey: normal and like, you can't live in that. Yeah. It's okay. You can't live in the highs all the time. Like you would never have a high.

If you just lived in the highs, it would just be constant. you have to remember that there's like highs and lows to everything. You can still be on the right track. You can still be doing what you're doing. You don't need this midlife quarter life, whatever crisis, it's okay.

It's co exist. Yeah,

Kate Christy: definitely. So since there are two of you all, how do you structure the inner workings of your business? Because I'm a solopreneur and I think that it's so interesting that you have someone who was an account manager, right? Because you touched on, Courtney, you said, you know, like you can, Get on this, work train, right?

And, like, not stop, like, not clock out, that's, like, a pro and a con about having your own business, right? Is, the sky's the limit, like, the money ceiling, doesn't exist, right? It's, like, if you can make it happen, if you can get there, like,you can grow, grow, grow, grow, grow, right?

But you don't have someone telling you, like, hey, time to clock out, but you also don't have someone telling you, hey, boundaries, that's all internal and that can be really hard and, like, Having to set those boundaries for yourself. But, Abby, you came from that account manager.

situation. So like Courtney, you kind of had this like a built in account manager for you. So how did that structure look like in terms of creating this business that was built around we're coming from this agency. These are the things that we don't like about it. These are the things that we like about it.

This is how we want to structure this to fit into our life. Not like us fitting into this business. Likewhat

Kate Christy: did those, structures look like for you all in the beginning?

I would say at the beginning, we were so excited to start duo that we were like, man, we got this. This is going to be great.

We're just going to work in the same capacity we do. And we do for the most part. But I think there were things where we were like, Oh, wow. Like when you run a business, you have so many more things and so many more hats that you have to wear that you're like, okay, well, neither of us have ever worn this hat who wants to take it.

And so we would both kind of explore in different areas. And, you know, she was. The client communicator all the time at the agency, right? I would show up for presentations on like what we were doing for them from a marketing perspective. But really she talked to them day in and day out. So we were kind of like, well, you are probably going to take lead on talking to the clients for the most part.

And once I got into it a little bit more and now even I think we should kind of restructure where like I can take on the branding, she can take on the SEO. So we can kind of lead our own clients. But at first she was a hundred percent client communication. And I was like, Girl, you go with it. Like you're good at that.

anything design, Abby's like, I don't want to touch that with 10 foot pole. Like you are going to create all the email templates and social. And I mean, there was just so many things we had to divvy up and I still think to this day, there are things where we're like, we need to hire this out or court, maybe you should run this or like Abby, maybe you should take this.

It's always evolving. I feel like I don't think it will ever stop evolving.

Abbey: no, it's always evolving and now even more so with kids routines and schedules and daycare and school, our schedules change all the time. And so work has to change. two things, when we first started, we were anti agency.

Like. We don't need project management system. we don't need to do this. We can just do it by ourselves. And then we realized, wow, okay. Project management systems are actually really helpful. Like we needed to like that to help us run our business. And so we immediately started using like Asana organize everything, favorite tool ever, literally tab open all the time.

And it's completely free. I do not understand it and I love them for it. so Asana, like amazing. But then the second thing we did. Right away, right when I quit and went full time was we hired a coach because we. our friends and business partners, and we were in very different phases of life. Courtney was still working full time and stressed out because she was working full time, hated it, and also had to work this job.

I was full time in this, wanting to grow the business, but knowing every ounce of business that we grow puts more stress on Courtney. So it was this weird time of like, you know, What are we going to do? I felt like I didn't want to just take control cause I didn't want Courtney to think I was secretly pushing her out or something weird like that.

You know, never thought

that by the way, the only thing I was ever worried about is that we were called duo collective and she was the only one showing up like in our social space and stuff like that. And I was like, I thought there were two of you. Where is this Courtney chick at?

And little did everybody know, I was just working at 2 a. m. and didn't want to bother everybody at that time. So,

Abbey: right. I know. So that was where we worked with our coach Val Marlene. She's amazing and incredible. We worked with her to help us build processes. Basically she helped us build email templates processes.

we did it for everything to organize it, to make my life and also to understand. Our roles and responsibilities. we were trying to coordinate new client discovery calls for both of us based on her work schedule. And like, I also didn't have that. And I was juggling nap schedules. So it was like this mix where I was like, this is really hard.

And like, even just the mental load of that, scheduling meetings is super hard. I remember

at the agency, we would try to make it so I could be a part of every call. And she'd be like, okay, well, what do you have going on at the agency? And I was like, okay, well, I've got this meeting, this meeting, this meeting, I can shove a 30 minute meeting in here and then I got to go.

And so I would join duo inquiry call meetings while on the clock at the agency. I'd like get off a call there, jump on a duo call and then jump back to the agency. So it was just not. Sustainable or efficient.

Abbey: No, and stressful. So the second, there were just small things we did where it was like, I will take all of those.

And then it's like, I will take all the client discovery calls. People don't need to know why it's me. It's just, I am the one that's interacting with clients right now. And then we started doing prerecorded videos for Courtney to share brand Inspiration. So that's how Courtney was able to, like, show her face and, like, still interact with the client in a way that worked with her schedule without needing to do meetings.

we made small adjustments that worked for both of us without putting extra stress and pressure on it. we've changed that a billion times since then because then Courtney went full time. And then. our worlds were different. My kids were in a different phase of life. I I had Remy, I think Remy started going to daycare at that time.

So then I had different daycare schedules.

She has. Okay. But also she's got the most insane daycare schedules. I still, to this day, I'm like, I don't know your daycare schedule. You just gotta tell me when you're available or not.

Abbey: And that was like, so even in the agency days, I negotiated two days at home with my babies.

I, got to work from home with my babies for two days. So Tuesday, Fridays were my days. So I continued that into duo and they went to daycare three days a week. neither of them actually went to daycare until they were 18 months. So either family helped, or I worked with them, which Remy was our little intern.

I worked with him every day for 18 months. So Remy, I worked with all the time and then he started going three days a week and now they go to school for three hours a day.

Kate Christy: So it's like a helpful, not helpful situation, yeah.

Abbey: So then it's a hope and pray then nap. it's different, but now we're in this phase of life where I can't do project management anymore.

Like I need to do the CEO stuff, I can't do project management, I can't build timelines. I can't do all of that. it's too much and I have three hours a day to be undivided attention to work. I'm working way more than three hours a day, but those are like my undivided, like. Get stuff. Yeah, get stuff done.

so that's where we hired someone recently to help us do all of that. And it has been the best decision we've ever made for our business. So she manages everything, gets new client proposals, gets all of that stuff done for us. And we can focus on the work. So like I manage everything from an SEO perspective.

Courtney does everything from a brand perspective. We each communicate with our own clients. And then we have Our amazing employee person, Heidi, that helps us do everything from the project management and talk with the clients and coordinate everything. And that was a shift we had to make this year because even with, those three hours, the three hours end at 11 a.

m. If we work with anyone in the West Coast, they got to meet with us before nine.

It's rough.

Abbey: So we had to bring in other people to help us because that's the reality. And it was either one of two things. It was either, I need to pay for more child care coverage, or we need to get someone else to help, like, have client calls, or share information, or do things to, like, keep our business moving forward.

While we're with our kids and that sounded way more desirable to me.

I also don't think like the more child coverage would have even solved that because at some point in your business, you realize that you actually need to hire out. You have to outsource because. She shouldn't be spending her time doing things like that, nor should I.

It's those smaller things in your business that need to happen to push your business forward. But you can train somebody else to do those because you actually have to be the CEO and the specialist in what it is that you're serving for your audience. So why not bring on a team or outsource it for somebody who can do that while you can focus on the bigger things of the business?

Yeah, absolutely. And I think we have a really hard time at first. We were like, no, this is our business. We have to do it all. We're the duo, it's not the trio or the whatever, you know? So I think that was hard for us to wrap our heads around. Like we have to do all of this, but then it's just not sustainable and you can't grow, you just simply can't grow it.

We couldn't grow our business if we didn't have the team that we have behind us.

Abbey: Yeah. I was telling Courtney that. It doesn't take that long to make a timeline, like put together a project timeline. But the brain power, like the brain cells I'm using to build that, I could be using somewhere else. Like you only have so much energy in your brain in one day to get things done.

And it's like, I don't need to waste that energy on something that someone else can help us do. So that was like, especially when you're

Abbey: mom, because

I didn't realize it until obviously a couple months ago, but you're on all day long. It doesn't matter if it's business, you're on while you're at your business and then you're a mom and you're on that when your kids are home.

So you don't really get a mental break. Yeah. So to say.

Abbey: No, you're constantly thinking about like today, my mom is picking the kids up from school. I'm like, I hope that went okay. Like, I'm thinking about all this stuff in the back of my mind. And I'm like, hopefully they didn't forget his monkey at school.

you think about just all this. stuff. And then you're like, I hope they drove safely. I hope they were buckled correctly in their car seat. which my mom is phenomenal. She can do all of this stuff like nobody's business, but you still like your mom brain never shuts off.

You think about all the things like the snacks you need for tomorrow. Did I open that string cheese correctly or is someone going to yell at me? Like all of these things that you're doing, It takes more brain cells and you only have so many each day before you can rejuvenate that night. If you get any sleep to do it all again tomorrow.

Yeah,

Kate Christy: 100%. I, was just telling my friend this morning about my saga with rescheduling doctor's appointments for my child and also picking up medication and how it turned into this, two hour ordeal that I was not expecting one morning. And the morning time is like my most productive time. And so then I've sit down at my desk.

I'm like, well. Today's shot.

Abbey: Right? Like, I'm drained. I have nothing left to give. It's so true. and I think that's the biggest shift we made this year, at the end of this year probably, is understanding where our time needs to go, and that our time and our energy are so valuable, and we need to put it in the right places, and we need to bring in other people to help us where we can't.

It's probably the best I've felt about our

business, honestly. Yeah. And when I came back from mat leave, I think after like all the fertility things we went through and coming back at duo, I came back with such a new perspective on it all because I was like, when we were going through all of that fertility issue, it was really hard for me not to have that on my mind.

90 percent of my day. So it was hard for me to be in the business. A lot of the time, it was hard for me to feel excited or motivated. And now that we've gotten through that, my whole perspective of everything has changed. And Abby and I figured out a way to make it so I could a nice long maternity leave, which bless her heart and like everything that we did to set it up and her running it while I was out.

But I think that also forced us and forced her to realize like, Hey, I can't be doing these things. We have to hire this out in order to continue to grow the business. And I think that maternity leave probably helped us realize like, Hey, we can hire other people to help us do these things and still make money and still grow our business.

Yeah, and I love how

Kate Christy: you were talking about Abby about how you're like, okay, well, I can pay for more child care, or I can pay for someone to come in and do these things and weighing the pros and cons of that. And I think we do. Get nay, I know we do get bogged down in our businesses doing the things that we're just so used to doing.

And we think that we're the only ones who can do them because we've been doing them since the beginning, because that's how everyone starts, right? You start your business and you start doing all the things because you have to do all the things. And then you get to that point where okay, I've just realized like, if we actually track our time and our habits and our business, you're like, well, I've spent half of the day doing all these little tasks that just add up that I haven't actually.

Um, and forth any energy into moving the needle, getting the project done, you know, deliverables for clients and things like that. And you can kind of flip back and forth between like, well, if I'm paying someone that's money out the door or whatever. And I just love how you're like, well, It's paying for more child care, or it's paying for someone to do these tasks, and I want these tasks done.

Yeah.

Abbey: Yeah, right. You're paying either way, usually, or, I do this frequently, is I know I have my uninterrupted time, and then I know I have my nap time, where I'm supposed to also some days, like, I work, and, It's hit or miss on whether it's a disaster or not and I've discovered like I used to do both I used to juggle working with Remy every day and doing the both thing.

I can't do that anymore they're so demanding and I feel crappy about it when I have to say no to like mom can you play with me I don't want that so that was a situation where I was like I can't do what I used to do. And I think the seasons like. That's something I've learned just in the seasons that they've been growing up is like, there was a season to do both.

When they were little, I could do it. I could juggle it. I can't now. Like, and that's okay. I have to ask for help or it's okay if I do want a little bit more childcare or I do want coverage because I do need that time for me and or vice versa. I just want someone else to do these tasks.

I don't want to pay childcare for me to do these tasks. Like you just understand, like, okay, what do I need and what's going to make me feel the best and then making that decision, which. Okay. It's ever evolving. There is no perfect schedule, perfect answer, perfect anything.

I had this moment of already feeling like a shitty mom the other week because I told Abby, I was like, okay, well, I was so excited about having Mila at home a couple of days a week, but I just got back and we're really busy and I'm like, okay, I just need to like, sit down and focus.

But I told Abby going into daycare, I was like, well, I'll probably keep her home on like Tuesday and Friday. Kind of like what you did too. And a Friday rolled around and I was Texting her or talking to her about work. And she's like, wait, isn't Mila home? And I was like, nope. I'm that shitty mom that brought her to daycare because I have stuff I need to do, or I'll just take that Friday and be like, okay, I have like eight loads of laundry I have to do.

I'm going to do them uninterrupted and then I'll go pick her up early and then I can spend time with her. So I know I'm not a shitty mom for doing that, but it's just like, You know, it's that mom guilt that you're like, okay, well, I was going to keep her home today, but there's other things that I need to do.

And it's easier to do with her being taken care of by someone else. Then I can get her early. And then I can actually just Be with her. So I think like the whole mom guilt thing is so real, but you have to figure out what works best for you and what works best for you and your baby is totally acceptable and a hundred percent fine and nobody should judge you on

Abbey: that.

Yeah. And the solution, if I think about the days where I really do have to work in the afternoon and they're not napping and they want my attention and I can't give it to them. Yeah. What's better? That? Like, me not being able to, like, give them the attention that they need, or having someone else give them the attention they need because I need to be somewhere else.

the guilt we put on ourselves to have a clean home, to have all organic food. To have activities for your kids while also being an entrepreneur that's making millions, while also being home all the time and homeschooling your children. Don't forget about that. Like literally the pressure is out of control to do all of these things all the time.

It makes you makeup on working out,

working

Abbey: out, having the perfect morning routine. Like we have none of

we are chaos behind the scenes actually,

Abbey: but it's Yeah, that's where, like, the imposter syndrome comes in of, okay, cut out the noise. What is, like, I don't care what everyone else is doing.

What do I want to do? Because I can tell you right now there are a handful of things that other people do that good for them. They look happy. I love it. I don't want to do that. that's not me. Like, I'm not going to be the PTA mom. that's not going to be me. So. But like, yeah, I do want to be the soccer mom that like goes to games like that.

So I will make that a priority because I want to do that. but you can't do everything. You can't do it all. And you have to prioritize just like you do in your business with what kind of mom you want to be too. And then finding the mix of both of them. It's hard. It's constant juggle.

Kate Christy: No, I love all that you said, because I.

To him very much like, okay, turn inward, what works for you, what do you want to do? Like take all of this noise away and just, do the thing that works for you and be okay with it. Because wild thing about mom guilt is it's no one's putting that on us, right? Like we are creating that we're making that our reality.

And I think that. Like Courtney, you're talking about, you know, taking her to daycare so you could get the things done or you had work to do or whatever, right?being able to separate working and momming is sometimes the absolute best thing that you can do for everyone, right? Because you have the time and the space to focus on whatever task it is, right?

Whether it's being a mom, whether it's being a business owner. And, or whether it's, you know, doing housework, right. Or whether it's doing nothing because permission to take your kids to daycare and then do nothing too, if that's what you need,

let's talk about that more.

Kate Christy: Yeah, because I, I like. Joke, but not really joke that, like,I'm not supposed to be a mom.

100 percent of the time. I think that's an impossible standard, like, talking about the standards that we're holding ourselves to as women, as mothers, as entrepreneurs and I'm like, I love my kids more than anything. I would be absolutely devastated if I didn't have them, but there are days that I don't want.

To be a mom. There are days that I don't want to deal with my business. There are days that I just want to be a singular individual human. That doesn't have to cater to anyone else's wants or needs or desires, right? Whether that's children, whether that's husband, whether that's business. Right. And that's okay because that's human.

and I think when Abby, you're talking about, homeschooling organic, like all this stuff that we're like, okay, like we have to like check all these boxes. And it's just like, no, like forget all that, make your own list. be right with yourself. And I think that makes for such a much more pleasant existence as a human, as a mom, as a business owner.

but yeah, there's, a lot of noise out there that we can kind of get sucked into and be like, Oh, this person's doing this over here. Like maybe I should be doing that. Does that make me a bad mom? Does that make me a bad business owner? but, being able to just kind of turn inward and filter out and be like, okay, if this works for me.

Then that's the right answer. Not whether or not this other person believes that to be true or not. So I love it. Go ahead. The

thing about motherhood that I've learned is that I've had so many other moms tell me this too. Cause I was just like, gosh, I really wish I could like work full time from home with her, with me the whole time.

And I've had so many women say like, you are. are still Courtney outside of being a mom. yes, you are a mom and that's a huge role and very rewarding, but you're also Courtney outside of that. Like you have to remember to find your solo time and whatever you have to do to be a better mom. So for me, that was taking her to daycare on Friday so I could get some things done because Then later when she's home, I will be a better mom because I will be more focused on her.

So I think that's the thing that we constantly just have to come back to also with being business owners is like, okay, how am I going to show up and be in my business that makes sense for me and my family so that later when I'm with my family or I need to be a mom, I am focused on that in there too.

So you're not. In both at the same time, because like we said, like you're always thinking about your business and you're always thinking about your babies, but how do you, separate that as much as possible so that you can show up and be the best you can be for both. Yeah. Which is hard. It's way easier said

Kate Christy: than done.

Courtney, whenever you came back from maternity leave, like this is fresh, right? Like this is a recent thing in the business. Did you feel prepared for it? Because you had seen Abby, like she kind of, led the way for you or were you just like, okay, I've got this. We're ready to go. And then it happened.

You're like, not how I expected it to happen.

are you talking maternity leave in general or coming back to, yeah, just

Kate Christy: like the transition from no baby to baby as it related to business.

The maternity leave was amazing because I think if I was on maternity leave with the agency, the closer it got to having to go back, I think the more depressed I probably would have gotten like, Oh man, great.

I get to go back to a job that I hate and I get to grind and whatever. But, it was weird. Like I loved the time that I had with her. It was, so nice to just completely check out. And I was able to check out more than I thought I would. There were times where I was like, should I check in with Abby?

Should I see how things are? Should I see if she wants to quit? Like, was this going to be a solo thing for me when I come back? But, she did a really great job of bringing in clients, running the business, not bothering me from a work perspective, checking in on me from a mom perspective. so my maternity leave was really amazing.

And then towards the end, I was actually like really excited to get back into work, which I don't know if that's true for a lot of women, I was also very devastated, like, Oh my gosh, my baby's going to go to daycare. I can't do this. And I cried to Abby for a couple of weeks prior, but it was the second or third day she was at daycare, I was like, This is great.

Like, I just have this time, you I love her dearly, but like, I have time where I don't have a baby on my chest and like, I'm not needed. I can sit here and like, actually, use my brain creatively. I think that was something that I really missed is that, when You have this newborn, you're just doing all of the newborn things.

Right. And it's on repeat. It's the same thing hour after hour. And I didn't get to like tap into my creative side. So I think once I came back, I was like, yes, let's do this. Like, do you have branding clients for me? Because I am ready to actually use my brain for something other than, you know, trying to keep a human alive.

I was really excited to dive back into it and we're doing some big things. For our business behind the scenes too. So I think that was really just fun to jump into doing things, for our business and I don't know, I'd have to ask Abby how I'm doing, if I'm getting an A plus or not, but it's great.

I think she was excited when I came back to it. I think she was just like, Oh, finally you're back. Yeah.

Abbey: And we talked about it too, because it's. This is probably the first time since we started our business where we both are 100 percent in the business, because of the phases of life that we had gone through to get there, that it's Awesome, but just we haven't had that.

So I think this is like, it's cool. And also we're giving ourselves the grace that we need to with also having kids and not having to do it all or be always on. that's not the goal. And that we've actually taken. Stuff off our plate by hiring people and like all of these things have been massive.

And I don't think we realized when we did it, like how big it would be just mentally for us to like make those shifts. So I think we're really excited. Yeah.

Kate Christy: So since other mothers and Possibly mothers who are entrepreneurs are listening to this. If you all would talk a little bit logistically about you, about what making that maternity leave for Courtney happened, like what that looked like, how you plan for that, how you organize that.

Like, you could kind of touch on the, nuts and bolts of that, I'd love to hear how you got that set up. This is coming from someone who has not taken a maternity leave.

Abbey: Oh

man, bless your

Abbey: heart. Yeah. Yeah, so we actually hired the same coach that helped us in Val. So we hired her, to work with us on it.

And Court and I are like, not afraid to have hard conversations. we have to. So we talked about it, like, during the time of like, what made me nervous, what made her nervous, All of the things from money to the time off to the responsibilities to everything we had like the program that we launched that yeah, we quit.

Yeah, so backing up last year, and this is something that I actually like I was having a really hard time at the end of last year about this time last year, because I was in and I'm an Enneagram three. So if you know anything about that, I'm just always in this achievement mode. I don't know how to be like, I don't know just how to.

I Take a chill pill and relax. Like that's not me. Literally

just a couple of days ago. She's like, Courtney, I just can't function. And I'm like, shut your computer, log off for the day, go take a walk. have to tell her that sometimes I'm like,

Abbey: just be like, I can't, like, it's, really hard for me.

It's something I'm working really hard on. I'm getting better at it. But, last year. I was in this just new idea phase. I want to do something new, do something different, grow our business to new heights. It was the worst time. someone should have just been like, Abby, look at everything happening in your life.

this is not the time to do it. So we started a, marketing mastermind that was supposed to be this whole year long program. We had two clients in it and we were doing it for a couple months and I was miserable. I hated it. And I realized that I would have to do this by myself while Courtney was gone.

And so we, I also didn't

like it, but I was like, we built a whole page on our website for this. We put all of this time invested money in

Abbey: it.

And yeah, I will never forget the one day I could tell she was miserable. I was too, but I feel like you show things like that a little bit more than I do. And so I was just like, Oh man, she's miserable.

And then she brought it up to me. She's like, I can't do this. I'm sorry. I have to quit this. And I was like, well, if you quit it, I also had to quit it because I cannot take on this entire program. And I had to sit with it for 24 hours because. I was like, wow, we put a lot into this. We invested money into this.

We promised our clients this, we were, pitching and selling to multiple other people and people that were saying, oh yeah, I'm going to sign up next year. I'm so excited. You're on my dream board, blah, blah, And I was like, oh, I was like, Abby, I can't just make this decision right now. I said, I have to sleep on this.

And I think it was good for us to both sleep on it for that 24 hours. But then we both did come to the realization, like, needed to break up with it.

Abbey: Yeah, that was probably like the worst I've felt in our business. It's the worst. Yeah, it was the worst by far. And it's also was a huge lesson for me personally, just to understand, like, you don't always need to be growing.

you can't always be in a growth season of your business. There needs to be times where you are just. Doing you're just flat. You're just speaking. That's okay. Yeah. And also our business is still growing, but unless you're building a new program, launching a new course, doing all of these new things, snagging bigger clients, like unless you're doing all those things, the outside world might not look like you're growing, but that doesn't matter.

Like it was definitely a realization where I was like, that was dumb. Courtney is about to have baby. She's about to be on maternity leave. Our business is changing dramatically. Like, we just need to be, we just need to like maintain what we're doing. We have systems in place, processes in place to allow Courtney to take time off.

We don't need to do something new. So that sucked, honestly, because it was a time where we let those two clients down. It sucked. It was a super hard conversation and we were honest about it. And we said this is a personal decision. This has nothing to do with you. It's us, like it's us, our time and our energy.

this wasn't right. We built a program that we didn't like and it really sucked because one, we gave them their money back, for the remainder of the year, was thousands upon thousands of dollars that we turned down consistent income for our business when court's to be out. So that was really scary.

We also poured. 6k into just building this program, and

that's just the financial part of it. Like we also poured our time and energy and hours into it as well. We

Abbey: did webinars. We did. Yeah. We did every, so it was huge and it sucked. And I think that's something that making those decisions, that decision though, was.

A really good decision for us, like we had to make it and that allowed us then just to be, which is what I had to learn during that time. I still failed because I still told Courtney, I was only going to take this amount of clients and I took more like, yeah, it was just

like, yeah, I took this many and we made this much.

And I was like, am I dying?

Abbey: Yes, I am. but that was my own fault. So everything we worked on with Val, we sat down, we talked about what I'm concerned about, what Courtney's concerned about, how much time should she take off, how much should she be paid, should I be compensated differently because of that, like all of this.

So we talked about all of that, laid it all out, came up with a plan that felt really good. And ever since we worked with Val in the early days, we've built our business on the profit first model. So we have five bank accounts set up. One is salary savings, and every month we put 50 percent of everything we make into salary savings.

We are not paying ourselves everything in that bucket. And so that bucket was our savings for Courtney to take a maternity leave, for me to take a bonus. Like,that's what that was. That is still how we function now. Mm-Hmm. . And that allowed us to take the breaks that we want to without feeling guilty, knowing we don't need, I knew I didn't need to take as many clients as I did, but I'm an Enneagram three, like what am I gonna do about it?

So I did. Yeah. But I knew I didn't have to. That was my decision. Mm-Hmm. . So that was also good to understand of like, what am I responsible for bringing in each month? And then knowing anything more is like. Whatever, like that's my choice. So those were all really good conversations we had, but yeah, it worked out great.

And yeah,

everything went really smooth, I would say.

Abbey: And it's allowed, like, obviously just because we own our own business doesn't mean you shouldn't get a maternity leave, and that you shouldn't get paid for it.

Yeah, we were very adamant about that because I feel like even in corporate America, they're not very good about.

Any sort of mad leave. So we were like, this is a very important time. And mean, it's my first baby, I'm quite literally learning everything. Right. And Abby's like, you a need this time and be, I think, I mean, it's only fair to compensate you. And so we made it work. Yeah.

Abbey: But yeah, that was our first maternity leave to manage because I had both of mine at the agency.

So that was our first maternity leave to manage under duo. And I think the best thing that we could have done was bringing in a third party, someone, but it was also a third party who knew us very well and helped us with our business from day one. So that was really nice because we were able to talk to her.

She knew both of us and we were able to like say the things that might've. felt uncomfortable or weird, but all things that are super important and that you have to talk about when you're in a partnership.

She was basically like our business therapist too, I would say that when we hired her, when we first started, there were definitely times where we would both be like, well, I just got done crying in a closet about this.

So can you help us figure this out? Yes. No,

Kate Christy: I love that. That's amazing that you all. Reached out and got that help because like, we were talking about a little bit earlier. You don't have anyone telling you what to do, right? That's all coming from, your internal thoughts, or maybe you're picking up information here and there that people are sharing online that you're like, oh, let's try this or let's do that.

Or we should be doing this. But having someone, come in and help you navigate. Those decisions is amazing. And now that I'm thinking about it, I'm like, I don't have a business partner, but I'm like, maybe I need someone to come tell me what to do

to like, remove

Kate Christy: that, mental load of it. Right.

And you were talking earlier, Abby, about having that person do those things, like create the timelines, Put the proposals together, like that kind of stuff. just like even putting a proposal together for me, like that's such an emotional thing as a business owner, right? there's so much tied up, especially like a creative, right?

Like you're, delivering this thing. If there's a monetary value on your creativity and you're just like, what is this worth? it can get very emotional if you let it. And like, just having someone who does not have that emotional attachment to your business to be like, Boom, dollar sign.

There you go. It would save so much mental, energy and emotional energy, just to have someone do that. And it sounds so silly voicing it out loud, but Yeah. It's so true. So maybe I'm gonna go find someone to do that for me, too. Yes.

Abbey: It's amazing. and even like today, we have a billion podcasts that we have to record, not just guests on our pod, but being with you and then also like recording our own individual podcasts and like all this stuff.

We have like a massive day. And the very first thing we had today was a discovery call with a client. And I was able just to say, Hey, can you send a proposal over to her? Done. I am no longer thinking about. that I need to do that while I'm doing all of these other things, so that just is incredible and that was one of the first things we did when he came back from maternity leave, we hire Heidi, which has been phenomenal.

Also, something that has completely changed. I feel like since I've been back is that we have actually worked together. physically together more than we have in the past four and a half years that we've had this business. We've actually like gotten together at least twice a month, maybe, which like almost never happened.

Abbey: We were really good about doing like, we used to get together and do real days. So we would record reels for a whole day, order lunch. It was fun, put on wigs, all the things. but we kind of stopped. I like when I got pregnant.

Yeah. Yeah. We were launching the mastermind and I was going through the pregnancy kind of ups and downs.

I mean, I didn't have a terrible pregnancy, but it was just like, yeah, I'm like trying to figure out Matt leave and like all of that stuff. So we just never got together. And ever since Mila has been born, I'm like, you come in here. Am I going there? What do we do?

Abbey: I know. I know.

It's fun. Yeah.

Kate Christy: so one thing you said about, the mastermind that you put together, right?

you had this idea, you went through with it, you got people signed up for it. And then you made that decision to not do it anymore and how hard that was. And I think that's such an important thing for you to share, because I know we'll like get ideas. And I don't know if this is like A female thing or what, where you say you're going to do something and you're like, well, I've got to follow through.

Like I've got to deliver on this thing that I've promised and I have to, I can't, you know, maybe that's more people pleasing, right? Like you can't, you can't back down now because you've said you're going to deliver this thing. And I think it's such an amazing thing for you all to share because.

There are so many times that we'll get on this path as a creative, whether that's like good intention or, we're following the advice of someone that's maybe not the right device for us, but we have to get so far in the process to realize, Oh, this is it for me. Right. But being able to say, No, I'm going to put this down.

I'm going to pivot. I'm going to change direction. I'm just going to stop this altogether. I think it's such a hard thing for us to do. so thank you for sharing that because I know I needed a reminder. In my business to be like, you know what, if it's not working, put it down, just walk away from it.

Move on to the next thing. Right. Or like, you were saying, stay with what's working, right? Pour your energy into those things in your business, because even though you're, staying even, or you're, not technically growing, right? Pouring your energy into the things that exist,

that's going to generate growth over time. yes, I love that. You all shared that and that. That was kind of wild that that happened all in this, find out you're pregnant and then put this thing together. Yeah. Was that, do you think maybe subconsciously that was like a, we got to like make money reflex?

Maybe. I don't know. It was something that we always kind of dreamed of wanting to do too. Like when we first started our business, but When we got into it and started it, we were like, Oh, absolutely not. This does not work for us. This isn't the thing that we thought it was going to be. It's not fun anymore.

It's actually really demanding exhausting. And. Yeah, I think even after we quit it, we were like, okay, we, I'm not gonna lie. I feel like we were kind of embarrassed that we had poured all that into it and it didn't work and we talked about it so much. Yeah, it was a sucky feeling in general.

Afterwards, we were like, we need. To eventually talk about this, we eventually need to do a podcast on this, which we've done and just kind of talk to our audience about it because we're not the only ones that are clearly going through this. So we're not the only ones that have started something and quit it in our own business because it wasn't working.

And I think people probably just don't talk about that enough. Like you. Feel guilty and you feel like you're the only one at the moment that's doing something like that, or you're letting people down. But in all reality, tons of business owners do it, or if they don't do it, they continue to do the thing that doesn't make them happy.

And that's also something that should be talked about too. Like, if you're doing something in your business and you have the control to quit it, you should feel Like you can quit it. It's not going to, it probably won't feel great. Cause it didn't feel great for us, but if we would have continued that, honestly, I don't know if I would have came back to a business partner.

She might've just said, I'm done, Courtney, you can do this. It's going to be called Uno or solo and bye. So I think eventually when we. Felt better about kind of talking about it. We did. And we've had a lot of people say like, we really commend you for that because it takes a lot of, courage and guts to kind of come forward and be like, yeah, we thought we were going to do this thing and like really be good at it and we were not good at it.

And it was not for us. I mean, we were good at it, but like we wouldn't feel good. Like we should have, like, it would not have been fair to our clients because we weren't in it, like we should have been in it,

Abbey: Yeah. Yeah. You can tell when your passion's not there, you're not going to perform at top capacity either.

And so if anyone's in this situation and they're thinking like, wow, I'm doing something I hate right now and I feel like I have to do it and I don't know how to get out. One of the first things we talked about was like, how are we going to make it right? how are we going to make this easy?

So for us, it was like, we offered options. We'll continue working through this quarter, and then we'll help transition you to other people that we know are right for your business. But during that season, we'll figure out what you need to do to make sure you're set up for success.

or, we give them the option to get their money back and stop right now. so we gave options and had those conversations, and then didn't lie. We were honest about why we made that decision, which sucked. But thankfully like both, they both understood. Yeah. They both get it.

They're both female business owners and understand the pressure and so we are very grateful and thankful for them for understanding. Mm-Hmm. ? still sucked. Yeah. Mm-Hmm? it. Like I vividly remember those feelings. Even today, it sucks. Yeah. It still sucks. It's still,

it's always going to suck.

Abbey: Yeah. we let people down.

ultimately we built a program. We let people down and that sucks. And we just had to like figuring out that game plan of we might not be able to be done with this right now, but we know now here's the out and here's, what's going to work for everyone. And then we got to figure out where we go from there.

it was a big Learning situation for us and I think if

people are in that phase right now, and they just heard us say it sucks and it's always going to suck. Don't let that. Don't let that scare you because I would rather have something like that. always suck a little bit in my business.

Something that we went through versus coming back and Abby's like, I quit. Like it could be the matter of your business, like staying alive or going out of business or shutting down or like completely just not in it anymore. So it needed to happen for our business to stay healthy and keep going. Word, but it always is going to suck a little bit, but just know that, when we say it sucks still to this day, it was

Abbey: still the right decision.

It was, yeah, it was still the right decision and all like for us, we are a marketing agency, that's what we've called ourselves forever. So we felt like we should be doing everything like marketing as a. Big bucket. There is a lot of things in there. We know and love doing marketing for our own business.

And we love doing email and we love doing Pinterest and we love doing social and we love all these platforms. Do we want to help everyone else do it too? No, unless we want to grow as a true agency and bring on a whole bunch of people to help us do that. So we had this idea in our head. Last year that we could do it all.

We could help people do it all. And that was where we realized, Oh, you love branding. I love SEO. why are we trying to do it all? Why can't we just get so experted into what we love that that is what we pour every ounce of energy into because we love it. We're passionate about it. And that just oozes out of us and what we do.

And that is where, after That failed, I'm using quotations, that opportunity, went away. We realized, we're already doing what we're meant to be doing. Let's just go all in. let's stop talking about all the other things. Let's go all in on branding and SEO. And that was the best shift we could have made for our business.

Kate Christy: Yeah. And, talking about how it sucked and it always sucks, right? And inevitably we're always making mistakes and we're always learning from those mistakes, and having that reminder of, We did this thing. It didn't work. We had to shut it down. Like, that sucks. Like, you're going to take that with you into those next businesses decisions that you're making, right?

You're going to say, Hey, I have this idea. And then you're going to put it through that filter of remember that time we did that thing and it didn't work out. Is Right. And I think that's such a, I mean, that's such a human thing though, right? learning from your mistakes, right? we can only be mad at ourselves when we don't learn from them and we make the same mistakes over and over again because we're kind of not caring that, Oh, that thing happened and that sucks with us through the different phases in the seasons.

And two. you pointed out, saying this, it's sometimes people are in these situations and they're looking for someone to give them permission. Right. And hearing someone say this on a podcast, like we quit this thing that wasn't working for us. And this is how we did it. This is what happened.

This is how it made us feel, but we did it. Then that person kind of, you know, might be like, Oh, I can quit this thing now because these people did this. And I think that that's something that's so cool about, especially being. A mom and an entrepreneur, right? Is that what we're doing now is kind of shaping future culture,

we're setting example for our children for what's possible where a lot of us in our generation grew up where, all of these work from home entrepreneur, jobs, like, didn't even exist. Right? And so now we're showing these kids. What's possible for them, like the range and variety of things that are possible, but also other business owners to about, Hey, like, we all left our corporate job for a specific reason, or we got into our business for a specific reason.

We can cut our own path. This is what I'm doing. Like, you can do it too. Or if it doesn't work for you, that's okay. But I don't know. I think it's just such a cool place to be in. If we can, you know. not bury ourselves in the running of the business to also be like, you know what?

we get to make our own rules and make our businesses what we want them to be in a way that feels good and works for us. And that we're staying in our, zone of genius or working into our passions. And I don't know, I think if we allow ourselves that we can definitely build that thing that we, dreamt of when we left that corporate job.

Absolutely. I also would say to people, if you're in that scenario where you want to quit something and you feel like you need permission, hopefully this is us giving you permission, but So I brought it up to my husband and we were pregnant and he knew that this was a big financial thing for us to save for maternity leave.

So when I talked to him about it, he was pretty hesitant too. And he was like, yeah. Well, first of all, you guys promised all of this stuff. You've already signed two clients and taken some of their money. Like you can't just quit this. And I was like, Justin, we have to quit this for the health of our business.

And I said, and Abby and I have already sat down and talked. Abby was like, Courtney, if we quit this and I take on X amount of SEO clients, I will be so much more happier. And this will cover what this program would have brought in for us. And at that point I was like, done. Let's do it. absolutely. You need to be happy, but we're still going to make the money that we need to make.

And I totally understand my husband's side of it. But I also had to stand up to him and be like, we will figure this out financially. Abby and I have already talked about it and we have to do this for the health of our business. I love you, but this is a decision that we are going to make and I need you to support me.

And he did, but if you have a business and a spouse, And you want to quit something, obviously you're most likely going to talk to your spouse about it. And if your spouse is hesitant, don't let that be the sole reason for continuing to do that thing that you hate. you have to be very open minded and have that communication and figure out how you're going to, turn or pivot if you do quit that thing.

Kate Christy: Yeah. And that just kind of really plainly put is that saying yes to the things that are yeses and saying no to the things that are nos, right? It's you're opening the door for all the right fits and closing the door to the wrong fits. So I wanted to ask one last question to both of you before we wrap this up is if there was any advice that you would give to working mothers about how to navigate both Balance juggle, like whatever terminology you want to use, like what's the best piece of advice that you've received or that, you've heard that you wanted to share with our listeners about how you manage both.

Oh, that's a loaded question. That's a heavy question. I know.

Abbey: I feel like the biggest thing, and this is something that I've been navigating myself, is just to figure out what you want without any outside noise. literally grabbing a notebook. going outside or in your favorite chair with your favorite blanket, wherever it is.

and just writing down, your vision of how you envision motherhood and business and or no business. just envision what you want for yourself. And, Understanding that first, before you look at what everyone else is doing, what everyone else says to do, and then figuring out, okay, now how am I going to make this vision happen?

does that mean working less? Does that mean taking less of an income because I want to be with my kids more? Or does it mean getting childcare because I want to grow a business and I didn't realize that's what I need? it doesn't matter what the answer is. There is no right or wrong answer.

Everyone. Has a different way to do motherhood, it's different for everyone and it's just about figuring out for you what you need and then leaning into it without the outside noise and if social media is giving too much for you, turn it off, like literally turn it off for a month, just Be yourself and discover what you like to do because there's so much outside noise that we can think that we need to or want to do something and that we really don't want to,

that was great advice.

So I, ditto that. But, my other piece of advice, I would say, since I'm new to motherhood, plus running a business is to, uh, Find your community of moms or of other business owners who are in the thick of it with you, because I know that there's been plenty of times that I've leaned on Abby or, the women in my neighborhood and, know, just on days where it's extra hard or days where you're questioning.

anything that you might be doing in your business or you have questions about, Oh my gosh, what do I do with this baby when X, Y, and Z happens? I think, having somebody to talk to even, Vent to, if you are having a bad day and you're like, man, I just need to sit down and talk, and I know you're a judgment free zone, so I'm going to sit and talk with you, I think, having that community to lean on and to talk to and to realize that you're not alone in this space is super important too.

Yeah.

Kate Christy: 100%. Thank you ladies so much. This was lovely chatting with you, hearing about your experience working together. I love talking to two people because I'm a individual. So it's always interesting to see how you both manage it and work together. Will you tell everyone? Where they can find you online, how they can connect with you, give them all the details.

Abbey: Yeah. So you can find us at duo collective. com. we also have a podcast, all things, Brandy and SEO, organic marketing, little bit of our life as well, sprinkled in there, obviously, cause we can't not, but that's duo on air, wherever to your podcasts. And then, we're also duo. collective on Instagram is probably where we're most active.

So. Perfect.